WarpDoctor - General Meeting for 2003-10-12
10-12-03 12:13 <WalterOS2> I guess we'll have an open session.
<WalterOS2> I'll start.
<wdl> OK. I'mm Secretarialy Logging.
<WalterOS2> Ken, you know the fellow who is writing a pure Java version of a DNS client?
<KenKrchnr> I don't _knoew_ him, but I know you mentioned him.
<WalterOS2> :-)
<WalterOS2> Well, his product didn't work with OS/2 at first, and that's why I requested your help. However his product, called JIP, is coming along. It's freeware, and he has spend and is spending a *lot* of time and effort making it compatible with eCS.
<WalterOS2> It's really quite slick.
<WalterOS2> I'm thinking once he swats the last couple of minor bugs, it would be good to advertising it in the usual OS/2-eCS circles and that it might even be a good addition to the eCS package.
<WalterOS2> Osuman--that's his name--is very nice to deal with and very responsive to users.
<WarpedeCS> howdy folks
<wdl> Hi!
<KenKrchnr> Hi Vaughn
<WalterOS2> Hi Vaughn
<WalterOS2> If anyone's interested, Osuman's web site is at http://www.bashiro.com/soft/
<wdl> Am I still on? My IRC screen just burped at me...
<WalterOS2> I can see you.
<WalterOS2> :-)
<wdl> Hmmm.
<WalterOS2> Vaughn, do you have your higher speed line, yet?
<KenKrchnr> Must be pretty slow at that ;-)
<WalterOS2> Looks like.
<WalterOS2> I just went to Osuman's web page and looked at the JIP page.
<WalterOS2> He's got three entries:
<WalterOS2> Windows version, naturally
<WalterOS2> MAC, UNIX, LINUX version, and (here's the kicker)
<WalterOS2> Version for all OSes--followed by an OS/2 Warp GIF. :-)
<WalterOS2> I guess that makes OS/2 Warp = all OSes !
<KenKrchnr> It's everything to everybody! ;-)
<WalterOS2> Right.
<WarpedeCS> yes...we have 3meg now
<WalterOS2> Right now he and I are working out a problem that causing JIP to completely disappear when it minimizes. It still runs, but you can't find it in the Minimized folder or in the Window List.
<WalterOS2> That means once it minimizes there is no way to restore it or anything. :-(
<WalterOS2> Vaughn: Are you still interested in having the VOICE server at your place?
<WarpedeCS> Walter...yes we have our permanent 3meg line in now which of course connects to a 10meg backbone but is throttled back to 3 meg at where wireless hits Fiber, Fiber is I think 150meg
<WalterOS2> 150meg--is that all? <VBG>
<WarpedeCS> that is what the fiber is running at now
<WarpedeCS> not sure what the high limit really is
<WarpedeCS> but our port of entry to the internet is capped at 3meg..untill we pay for more
<WalterOS2> This is at your home or the school?
<WalterOS2> BTW, there will no meeting of either VOICE or Warpdoctor next weekend.
<WalterOS2> Everyone will be at Warpstock. Except me. <sniff>
<WalterOS2> I would desperately like to come, and came very close to making THE CALL a few days ago when I found flights at a good price.
<WalterOS2> However, the health risk for me is just too great. <sniff>
<WalterOS2> I would love to meet Ken, Doug, and Mark, and the others who will be there.
<WarpedeCS> WalterOS2: I would have to check with our local ISP and ask him again
<KenKrchnr> I talked with you very briefly at Warpstock Philly ;-)
<WarpedeCS> WalterOS2: I would have to check with our local ISP and ask him again hosting Voice here
<WarpedeCS> I would need some info on average traffic coming off of Voice
<WalterOS2> Vaughn: You can find the stats at: http://warpdoctor.org/webstats/raw/
<WalterOS2> But you must remember that by the time you get the server, it will be only a backup or a mirror, so the traffic should MUCH left.
<KenKrchnr> That wouldn't be for voice tho', I don't think there are any current stats for voice.
<WalterOS2> Ken: Can you refresh my memory as to whether we were going to make VOICE1 into the mirror or the backup?
<KenKrchnr> It would be both actually.
<WalterOS2> Could you explain?
<WalterOS2> How many systems will you have at your place?
<WalterOS2> VOICE-related systems, obviously. :-)
<KenKrchnr> Voice1 would be updated nightly as a backup, it could be pressed into mirror service as needed.
<WalterOS2> OK
<WarpedeCS> k...thanks about the stats page
<WalterOS2> I think of a mirror as an alternate site to a main site with the idea that both would be available all the time. The multiple TUCOWS servers, for example.
<WalterOS2> Again, for me a Backup server is one that gets used only when the main one goes off-line for some reason.
<KenKrchnr> Yes, the kicker is choosing the frequency of sync'ing the servers.
<WalterOS2> I understand.
<WalterOS2> Mark used to send out stats on the usage of VOICE1 every month or so.
<KenKrchnr> OS2VOICE would be relatively static and easily mirrored or even load balanced. Warpdoctor, with the database might be
<WalterOS2> I don't know if I could find one, though.
<KenKrchnr> more problematical. Doug is working on that portion of the strtegy.
<WalterOS2> OK
<KenKrchnr> Mark had mentioned that he was months behind on the stats. I think last was Jan or Feb.
<WalterOS2> Vaugn: Here is the URL for OS2VOICE usage over a 12 month period ending Jan 2003 http://www.os2voice.org/weblogs/
<WalterOS2> That's a better indicator.
<WalterOS2> Sorry: Vaughn.
<WalterOS2> Darn finger-poking!
<KenKrchnr> Now you did it, you offended him ;-)
<WalterOS2> I hope I didn't insult him.
<WalterOS2> If he doesn't return, I can email him the URL.
<KenKrchnr> Is Vaughn the voice postmaster?
<WalterOS2> I'm going to have leave for a minute or two--I've a raging headache, and if I don't take something, I'll never get rid of it. :-)
<WalterOS2> bbiab
<KenKrchnr> brb as well
<WalterOS2> Hi Mark
<MADodel> hello Walter
<wdl> Hi Mark.
<MADodel> Am I too late?
<WalterOS2> No, we're just having an informal meeting this week.
<WarpedeCS> hi...forgot ISP is doing minor maintence to network
<WalterOS2> I lost my system on Thursday, so the meeting didn't get announced, and Doug can't be here.
<MADodel> I'm trying to print off the VOICE brochures for Warpstock. My printer doesn't seem to like the heavy card stock. Keeps getting things off alignment. I'll try to print as many as I can.
<WalterOS2> Vaughn: Did you get the second URL I gave you?
<WarpedeCS> sorry I never got it
<WalterOS2> OK, I'll repeat it.
<WarpedeCS> Mark...what brochures?
<WarpedeCS> you need color?
<MADodel> WarpedeCS: The brochures we hand out at the VOICE table
<WalterOS2> Here is the URL for OS2VOICE usage over a 12 month period ending Jan 2003 http://www.os2voice.org/weblogs/ . That's a better indicator.
<WarpedeCS> k...walter...thanks
<WarpedeCS> yes..much better...
<KenKrchnr> Mark, how many do you need to print?
<WarpedeCS> I was given a color laser printer to me...it is an HPc4500DN duplex unit...
<MADodel> I'll try for 100.
<WalterOS2> Ken: You asked if Vaughn is the VOICE postmaster.
<KenKrchnr> Yes
<KenKrchnr> (not yes he is, yes I asked)
<WarpedeCS> takes two guys to move it and comes with its own stand
<WarpedeCS> what kind of card stock...
<WarpedeCS> I could give it a try
<WalterOS2> Vaughn is the Mailing List Administrator, so I guess he's the closest thing we have to a Postmaster. :-)
<WarpedeCS> hehehe...
<WarpedeCS> Mark...what file format is the Voice flyer in?
<MADodel> Its 67lb, 8.5x11 medium card stock.
<MADodel> Its in LWP
<MADodel> I have about 20 printed so far. I just have to keep an eye on it and not print too many at a time. Once it gets off alignment then all the following are screwed up
<WalterOS2> Decided to rejoin us, Bill?
<WalterOS2> Mark: I just don't like printers. :-(
<WarpedeCS> how many days till warpstock starts?
<wdl> My ISP dumped me without warning. I saved the log to that point. *Just* restarted it.
<MADodel> only 6 days
<WalterOS2> The whole business of forcing a flimsy material (paper) through all kinds of mechanical obstacles seems to be fraught with problems.
<WalterOS2> However, we do need them occasionally.
<WarpedeCS> crap...should have told me sooner...I could have given it a try with this laser
<MADodel> They use color though. The headings and the logo are in color
<KenKrchnr> Mark, I have 65# cover stock (92 bright) and an OKIColor 7300N if you'd like to give it a shot.
<WarpedeCS> Mark my HP 4500 is color
<MADodel> WarpedeCS: Ididn't know you had a color laser.
<KenKrchnr> (You're not doing edge to edge are you?)
<WarpedeCS> yea... big mother
<MADodel> Ken: You are coming to Warpstock aren't you?
<KenKrchnr> Yes, I'll be there.
<MADodel> Ken: No edge to edge. The OS/2 driver for y Epson doesn't support that unfortunately, so I had to adjust the margins quite a bit.
<MADodel> WarpedeCS: Are you coming to Warpstock this year?
<WarpedeCS> No...too busy at work to get away...I might be going to Vega Comdex though but that doesn'help ya
<KenKrchnr> The OKI won't do borderless either, but it's not a humongous margin.
<WarpedeCS> I don't think my package of paper would get to ya quick enough
<MADodel> Ken: Since you are coming, maybe you could try printing a few to bring with you. I'll send you the LWP file
<KenKrchnr> OK, I'll print some tomorrow.
<WarpedeCS> send me a copy too Mark..
<MADodel> WarpedeCS: Yeah, that's why I asked if you were coming. Plus my experience with Canada Post hasn't been the best experience. Stuff takes unbelievably long times to get places.
<WarpedeCS> I would send it priority but that would do it with extra $$$
<WalterOS2> Cross border mailing can really be the pits. :-(
<MADodel> OK I'll send you both a copy.
<WarpedeCS> Depends on now you send it...I can send stuff priority to Germany in 8 days no problem
<WarpedeCS> now=how
<WarpedeCS> Mark are you going to be staying in the hotel there?
<MADodel> yes I'll be in the hotel
<WarpedeCS> you have a room # and address
<MADodel> No room number. But anything sent to Warpstock, directed to me should get to me there.
<WarpedeCS> ok
<MADodel> Address is on the web site. Let me check
<WarpedeCS> is the address on warpstock site?
<MADodel> Warpstock schedule is finally up - http://www.warpstock.org/2003/presentations/schedule.html
<MADodel> Double Tree San Francisco Airport 835 Airport Blvd. Burlingame, CA 94010-9949
<WarpedeCS> and attention that to you Mark?
<MADodel> yes
<MADodel> Make sure it says for WARPSTOCK
<WarpedeCS> K...I gotta run...going to motherinlaws for Thanksgiving supper ....I will ....later...God Bless
<WarpedeCS> if the laser prints it ok...I will send it off..to ya at Warpstock
<WarpedeCS> my email is vbender@rfnow.com or vaughn@stechgroup.ca
<WalterOS2> Vaughn: Is your laser printer a colour machine?
<KenKrchnr> Yes it is.
<WalterOS2> That was a quick name change. :-)
<KenKrchnr> We both have color lasers :-)
<wdl> Died again???
<KenKrchnr> wdl, I see you.
<WalterOS2> I wanted to ask what model it was and how much it cost, etc.
<WalterOS2> That would have meant more from Vaughn since we both live in Canada. :-)
<wdl> This is all Sooooo weird. I lose contact - nothing in/out the wire. Unresponsive.
<KenKrchnr> Vaughn has a HP 4500DN (color, duplexing, network card)
<wdl> Thank you KenK, for seeing me. ;-)
<WalterOS2> OK, now I have to find out a machine like that costs in Canada.
<KenKrchnr> I have an OKI 7300N (color, network, no duplex)
<KenKrchnr> 4500's here are down to ~1400
<WalterOS2> What does "duplexing" mean wrt lasers. I've seen the term, but don't understand it. :-(
<KenKrchnr> Prints on both sides of the paper.
<WalterOS2> Ah.
<KenKrchnr> We have b/w duplex printers. But the OKI is manual duplexing ;-)
<WalterOS2> We just bought our son a whole system, including a Monitor, from a discount house for only slightly more that!
<WalterOS2> $1400, that is.
<KenKrchnr> Well, 5 years ago a color laser would set you back over 7000, not too shabby.
<WalterOS2> True.
<MADodel> This brochure is a tri-fold printed on both sides BTW. I just print 10 on one side turn them over and print the other side.
<KenKrchnr> Color lasers are cheaper (well, less expensive) to run than inkjets.
<WalterOS2> If I continue to have unsolvable problems printing colour, I may just bite the bullet and buy one, but they're still terribly expensive (for our pocketbook) up here.
<KenKrchnr> Manual duplexing :-)
<WalterOS2> That's the problem. My son can print a cover for a DVD and use up a whole colour cartridge.
<WalterOS2> cover=label
<WarpedeCS> the Manitoba government gave me the printer...hey I am in education and they are giving them away..
<KenKrchnr> Here, you can now pick up an OKI C7200 for less than $750. While they last.
<WarpedeCS> the schools don't want the printer...so I inherited it
<WarpedeCS> TTL
<WalterOS2> Meanwhile I've got a couple of HP print servers on the way, and I'll see what I can do with them.
<WalterOS2> Right now, all we have around here is B/W. I have a colour ink-jet, but I can't get it work online.
<WalterOS2> I *think* the print server on my SMC7004ABR router is grabbing all print commands.
<KenKrchnr> Grabbing them from where?
* MADodel only has inkjets. Maybe a color laser some day, but my Epson 1520 is a work horse usually, so I don't see any need for a new printer anytime soon.
<KenKrchnr> I like Epsons as well. I have the 600, 785 and 820. Tho' the 600 doesn't see much use anymore.
* WalterOS2 can't afford the inket cartridges. But they're still cheaper than colour lasers.
<KenKrchnr> Depends on how many dvd's your son makes ;-)
<WalterOS2> Ken: My Epson Colour Injet is on another workstation. Any print commands must go out on the LAN to get to the WS. That means they go through the router, which contains the Print Server.
<WalterOS2> It's the only thing I can think of.
<KenKrchnr> Is it a netbios print station or tcpip?
<WalterOS2> I haven't had a chance to remove the printer from the router to see what happens then.
<WalterOS2> netbios
<WalterOS2> Sorry the workstation has three protocols:
<WalterOS2> tcpip
<WalterOS2> netbios
<WalterOS2> netbios over tcpip
<KenKrchnr> Then the router should not be able to interfere. Unless the router understands netbios print commands.
<WalterOS2> I can transfer files through the router, so I would assume it does.
<KenKrchnr> Nah, that doesn't mean it understands what the packets are, it's just being told where they go.
<WalterOS2> Whenever I transfer files from one WS to another, I always use File and Print (Peer) Service
<WalterOS2> Then, tell me what *you* think the problem is. :-)
<WalterOS2> VBG
<KenKrchnr> How does the printer show up on your net workstations?
<WalterOS2> Hang on
<KenKrchnr> (like; \\anotherpeer\thatprinter)
<WalterOS2> OK, the Epson is physically connected to WS SERVER, and shows up there as a SHARE called EPSONSTY.
<KenKrchnr> And if you do a "net view \\ws_server" does it show up on your workstation?
<WalterOS2> From my main system, it can be seen as a remote printer connected to WS SERVER
<KenKrchnr> Is it printing to a local port?
<WalterOS2> On SERVER, yes, but I'm not sure it prints. Let me check.
<WalterOS2> No I can't printer from SERVER, either.
<WalterOS2> printer=print
<WalterOS2> No errors, it just does nothing.
<KenKrchnr> That would be the place to start. If it can't print to its own local port it'll never work over the network :-)
<WalterOS2> 2
<KenKrchnr> Is it on lpt1?
<WalterOS2> Now I feel positively dumb. :-(
<WalterOS2> Somehow it got assigned to LPT2. I've moved it to LPT1, and now it's printing--from its own WS.
<WalterOS2> Man! Is it slow compared to my laser.
<KenKrchnr> Yeah, lasers are a bit faster.
<WalterOS2> :-)
<KenKrchnr> Now that it prints try from the other station.
<WalterOS2> When it is finished with the test file I told it to print from SERVER, I'll try from WD, my main computer.
<WalterOS2> OK, it just finished. Now I'll try from this computer.
<KenKrchnr> Does the job it's printing show up in the printers status window on WD?
<WalterOS2> It still won't print from WD.
<WalterOS2> Same as before: just does nothing.
<KenKrchnr> Does the job show up in the status window?
<WalterOS2> Status window? I'm not sure what you mean. :-(
<KenKrchnr> Printers - epsonsty - job view
<WalterOS2> No
<WalterOS2> I'll try again.
<KenKrchnr> Does the printer show as online - 0 jobs
<WalterOS2> Still nothing.
<KenKrchnr> Are you printing to the printer queue, or an lpt port at the workstation?
<WalterOS2> Seems to be online.
<WalterOS2> Network Status says it's Available.
<KenKrchnr> Is the spooler enabled at both the server and the workstation?
<WalterOS2> LPT1:
<KenKrchnr> LPT1 on the workstation?
<WalterOS2> Yes
<KenKrchnr> Is lpt1 mapped to the network printer?
<WalterOS2> Both Spoolers are enabled.
<WalterOS2> On WD?
<KenKrchnr> No, on the workstation does lpt1 map to \\server\epsonsty
<KenKrchnr> (yes, on WD)
<WalterOS2> No. On WD lpt2 is \\server\epsonsty
<KenKrchnr> Try "dir/w>lpt2"
<WalterOS2> nada
<KenKrchnr> Did the print job show up?
<WalterOS2> No, nothing happened at all.
<KenKrchnr> OK, try "dir/w>capt.txt"
<KenKrchnr> Then drop capt.txt into the printer window.
<WalterOS2> Nothing happened.
<WalterOS2> I'm sorry, Ken, but I just got the supper page.
<WalterOS2> Maybe we can continue this later.
<KenKrchnr> OK, we'll continue another time.
<WalterOS2> Again, I really appreciate your help. :-)
<wdl> Umm - gotta split 'real soon now'. Can I close the log? KenKrchnr: do you want this one formatted, and sent to you??? And I still need to discuss changes you'd like, ...scripts, a'that.
<KenKrchnr> No problem.
<WalterOS2> Bye for now.
<KenKrchnr> wdl, I think we're done with the log. Did you check out the logs online?
<KenKrchnr> Bye Walter
<wdl> Ken: Yes. I can do that HTML stuff in my own script, likely. Or use yours, or...
<wdl> Ken: I do think a few *times* ought to be retained: open/close/...
<wdl> 'Bye Walter
<KenKrchnr> Mine is no great shakes. I just did it to try to get closer to what was on voice transcripts.
<wdl> Ken: Send it to me, and I can incorporate yours with mine.
<KenKrchnr> I'm not sure if times are good or not. They weren't in older logs, and don't seem to serve much purpose.
<KenKrchnr> I'll send you a copy of mine this evening.
<wdl> Ken: "serve...purpose..." Your choice. For me, EVolution - not REVolution. ;-)
<KenKrchnr> But (times again), I don't know if it matters one way or the other. Older logs had none, voice transcripts don't. But many Warpdoctor logs do. Decisions, decisions ;-)
<wdl> Ken: In my previous posts as Secretary in various groups, Open/Close at least were thought to serve some (possible) future legal purpose...
<KenKrchnr> I'll send you my script, you can take a look and see what you'd like to leave in/take out. And we'll go from there, how's that?
<wdl> Ken: Cool! Uh, ...no problem!
<KenKrchnr> OK, I gotta go now too, so see ya soon.
<wdl> Guess I gotta bug out. Wife's toe-tapping again. :-(
<wdl> 'Bye all.
<KenKrchnr> Bye
10-12-03 15:00 *** Log Terminated.