02-02-103 12:05:47 This meeting of WarpDoctor is now in session. 02-02-103 12:06:22 Has everyone got, or at least seen the agenda? 02-02-103 12:07:32 For those of you don't, The URL is at http://www.warpdoctor.org/agendas/warpdoc_2003-02-02.html 02-02-103 12:09:32 Item A1a: Hardware Compatibility Matrix 02-02-103 12:09:52 Gord/wdl, do have an updated draft form? 02-02-103 12:10:11 If everyone agrees, I'll send two drafts like last time? 02-02-103 12:10:14 do you have....? 02-02-103 12:10:50 Here comes, shortly 02-02-103 12:10:58 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 02-02-103 12:11:31 WDoc-input_pag1.txt 02-02-103 12:11:49 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 02-02-103 12:12:35 1-29-2003 -wdl 02-02-103 12:12:36 This is the PROPOSED Warp Doctor page for 02-02-103 12:12:36 http://www.warpdoctor.org/hcl/linput.html . 02-02-103 12:12:36 Line ## follow those shown/proposed in the WarpDoctor IRC of 1-26-03. 02-02-103 12:12:36 ____________________________________________________________________ 02-02-103 12:12:37 01 You may send it as a text file using this format: 02-02-103 12:12:39 02 02-02-103 12:12:41 03 Is this device usable?: (*)Yes ()Partially ()No 02-02-103 12:12:43 03a On which Version and FixPak?: 02-02-103 12:12:45 04 Hardware Manufacturer: 02-02-103 12:12:47 05 Manufacturer Web Page: 02-02-103 12:12:49 06 Product Description (include Mod.#): 02-02-103 12:12:51 07 Came wi 02-02-103 12:12:55 rivers: 02-02-103 12:12:55 07a If not, where (URL) did you get USABLE drivers?: 02-02-103 12:12:56 08 Additional Information: 02-02-103 12:12:58 13 02-02-103 12:13:01 26 *Submitted by: 02-02-103 12:13:03 27 *E-mail: 02-02-103 12:13:05 28 Date: mm/dd/yyyy 02-02-103 12:13:07 29 02-02-103 12:13:09 29a *Required (but E-mail addr will not be published UNLESS you request). 02-02-103 12:13:11 29b 02-02-103 12:13:12 30 Unless otherwise noted, all content on this site is Copyright (C) 2000, 2001, |VOICE| 02-02-103 12:13:15 ____________________________________________________________________ 02-02-103 12:13:17 NB: 02-02-103 12:13:19 vertical bars " | " bracketing a word mean the included word is "clickable". 02-02-103 12:13:21 -eof$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 02-02-103 12:13:26 $$$$$$$$$$Did *all* that get through? Ends with "-eof" in both cases. Doesn't show on my screen. 02-02-103 12:13:45 I got it. 02-02-103 12:14:26 Well, I got one -eof. 02-02-103 12:14:42 Same here. 02-02-103 12:16:40 First some got trashed. Trying again. 02-02-103 12:16:49 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 02-02-103 12:16:59 1-29-2003 -wdl 02-02-103 12:16:59 This is the PROPOSED Warp Doctor page for 02-02-103 12:16:59 http://www.warpdoctor.org/hcl/input.html . 02-02-103 12:16:59 Line ## follow those shown/proposed in the WarpDoctor IRC of 1-26-03. 02-02-103 12:17:01 ____________________________________________________________________ 02-02-103 12:17:03 01 In the case of devices which use a specific computer interface, such as USB, an 02-02-103 12:17:05 02 internal card or Bluetooth please include it in the additional information field. 02-02-103 12:17:07 03 02-02-103 12:17:09 04 02-02-103 12:17:11 05 Is this device usable?: (*)Yes ()Partially ()No 02-02-103 12:17:13 5a: On which Versi 02-02-103 12:17:15 : [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:17 06 02-02-103 12:17:19 07 *Hardware Manufacturer: [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:21 08 *Product Model [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:23 09 Manufacturer URL: [http:// ] 02-02-103 12:17:25 10 Did Manufacturer 02-02-103 12:17:27 11 provide USABLE OS/2 drivers?: ()Yes (*)No 02-02-103 12:17:29 11b What drivers DID work?: [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:31 12 ...where did you get them (URL)?: [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:33 13 Additional Information: [ ...big... ] 02-02-103 12:17:35 14 *Your Name: [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:37 15 *Your E-mail: [ ] 02-02-103 12:17:39 16 02-02-103 12:17:41 17 {Send} {Clear} 02-02-103 12:17:43 18 02-02-103 12:17:45 19 *Required Field (but E-mail addr will no 02-02-103 12:17:47 NLESS you request). 02-02-103 12:17:50 20 02-02-103 12:17:52 21 If you are sending a large quantity of devices' information, you may save your time 02-02-103 12:17:54 22 as well as ours by using the next |format| and then sending the list directly to our |e-mail|. 02-02-103 12:17:55 23 02-02-103 12:17:57 24 Unless otherwise noted, all content on this site is Copyright (C) 2000, 2001, |VOICE| 02-02-103 12:17:59 ____________________________________________________________________ 02-02-103 12:18:01 NB: 02-02-103 12:18:03 " () " is a button; " (*) is a selected button; 02-02-103 12:18:05 a leading asterisk " * " indicates the following text-line is in RED typ 02-02-103 12:18:07 ] " is box into which info may be typed; 02-02-103 12:18:09 the one string " ...big... ", merely indicates that one info-box spans several line-widths; 02-02-103 12:18:11 the one string " http:// " is pre-entered into its box; 02-02-103 12:18:13 " ...big... " only indicates the box spans several line-widths; 02-02-103 12:18:15 " { " and " } " bracketting a word indicate a pushbutton with the included word; and 02-02-103 12:18:17 vertical bars " | " bracketing a word mean the included word is "clickable$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ 02-02-103 12:18:19 ????? 02-02-103 12:20:03 Both files should start with a date: 1-29-03, and end with -eof 02-02-103 12:20:20 wdl: this time I didn't see any -eof. :-( 02-02-103 12:21:50 It might be better if you emailed or uploaded the form to rs, and let him convert it an actual temporary form. 02-02-103 12:22:04 Gord has seen them before, I think? So if he got'em, I gues they're OK? 02-02-103 12:23:26 IF RS is busy I can put them up as a sample HTML form 02-02-103 12:30:31 OK, Doug, since we have you "on the line", what's the latest with your DB2 stuff? 02-02-103 12:31:30 I am finishing up with the "editor". When that is done I will add enough content to the database to show have each of the "categories" looks 02-02-103 12:31:43 and then it will be "released" 02-02-103 12:32:38 Ken, what version of DB2 do you have on your server? 02-02-103 12:33:02 I don't have any on the server, but I have a copy somewhere... 02-02-103 12:33:21 I need to get out to the "dead computer room" to find it. 02-02-103 12:33:29 Can you find out what version it is? 02-02-103 12:33:33 Walter _ i have been thinking of the mirror / DB2 issue this last week. 02-02-103 12:33:42 Yes, this week. 02-02-103 12:33:56 How about if we try running something like PostgreSQL on the mirror and DB2 on the main server? 02-02-103 12:34:21 In English, please. 02-02-103 12:34:44 Sorry - PostgreSQL is a free, open source SQL database that has been around a long time 02-02-103 12:35:01 Actually - before SQL was an "accepted" language 02-02-103 12:35:10 It is ported to OS/2 and is very capable 02-02-103 12:35:49 It is probably not as fast as DB2, and I suspect that it will not be as "capable" with intense SQL as DB2 is 02-02-103 12:35:55 How does that solve your problem of compatibility between your DB2 Engine programming for the engine? 02-02-103 12:35:58 but then again - not many other databases are 02-02-103 12:36:42 The database "engine" is designed to be database netural, i.e. it will access the database either throught the DB2 client or through ODBC 02-02-103 12:36:47 PostgreSQL has an ODBC driver 02-02-103 12:36:53 You said you needed some of the features of v.4 to make life easier, which weren't available on v.2. 02-02-103 12:37:24 Some of the features of version 5 - mainly outer joins, and triggers. Both of which PostgreSQL has 02-02-103 12:37:27 This is your database engine? 02-02-103 12:38:00 Sorry, I got the version number mixed up. 02-02-103 12:38:17 I have used it a little before. I use DB2 v 5 on my server as my main database. And it may turn out that when we get into it PostgreSQL won't work - the devil is in the details you know 02-02-103 12:38:57 I think however, that is would be in the best interest of WD, and the OS/2 community, it we make our stuff as "portable" as possible 02-02-103 12:39:32 I will probably have to write the triggers twice - once for DB2 and once for PostgreSQL. But that won't be that big of deal (I think) 02-02-103 12:39:52 We should, of course, get the DB2 side working first 02-02-103 12:40:30 I guess I am suggesting that we hold off on trying to get another version DB2 for Ken's machine, until a little later 02-02-103 12:40:45 Unless there is one waiting around to be got 02-02-103 12:42:43 Haven't seen any on eBay in the past cople of weeks. 02-02-103 12:42:47 Doug: But doesn't having 2 different setups make the mirroring more difficult? 02-02-103 12:42:53 couple even ;) 02-02-103 12:43:32 If the we can define the tables on DB2 and PostgreSQL with the same field types, then most of the problems go away. 02-02-103 12:44:12 To exchange the database between two machines (mirror and server) we will have to export the data from one database (machine) and import it into the other 02-02-103 12:44:38 Unless we want to try something like a federated database, 02-02-103 12:44:48 As I'd mentioned before, I have a CD of DB2 v7.1. Is there a reason I couldn't send that to Doug for his/our use? Uh, "Personal Edition", I think. 02-02-103 12:45:35 Thanks for the offer WDL. I have v 6.x and 7.x (I still like v 5 best though) 02-02-103 12:46:12 The problem is the licensing changed with version 6 (I believe). There is an internet restriction with v 6 on that requires a large sum of money 02-02-103 12:46:37 where with version 5 the license is only for the number of simultaneous connected users 02-02-103 12:47:07 So while personal edition will technically run ok, the licsense will kill us 02-02-103 12:48:29 If I remember correctly v 6 to use as an internet server is something like $2600 02-02-103 12:49:14 Version 7 is probably even more expensive 02-02-103 12:51:07 Please let me repeat> I am not saying that PostgreSQL will work on the mirror. Merely suggesting that it might be work investigating before we try to acquire another copy of DB2. 02-02-103 12:51:45 Unless there is another copy available (i.e. eBay) that is very cheap 02-02-103 12:52:05 work= worth 02-02-103 12:56:22 Ken, can we set up your eBay program to watch for a certain program to become available? 02-02-103 12:56:40 Yes, I do it all the time. 02-02-103 12:57:29 Then I suggest we appoint Ken as the eBay watcher for DB2 v.5. :-) 02-02-103 12:57:41 That's why I said there was nothing in the past couple weeks, I've been monitoring. 02-02-103 12:58:09 So we are looking for a DB2 v5 license? We can't use a v7.x license and just use v5? 02-02-103 12:58:38 I've just looked for any OS/2 ver. > 4 02-02-103 12:58:45 The problem is the license for version 7 is pretty bad (bad=expensive) 02-02-103 12:58:57 Mark, I'm pretty sure the v7.1 licence is "personal use only" 02-02-103 12:59:22 I'm referring to the copy on my HD. :-) 02-02-103 12:59:45 What if we could get IBM to give us a copy? I know its not likely since they hate OS/2, but I could ask someone in IBM Germany. 02-02-103 13:00:07 That would be great! 02-02-103 13:00:22 Mark, haven't you already tried that? 02-02-103 13:00:31 Walter: Yesfor the personal version that is true. But IBM has multiple licensing for 7.x 02-02-103 13:00:55 I've never asked this person. We asked IBM Canada. 02-02-103 13:01:05 They never responded. 02-02-103 13:01:24 As long as it is not in German. :-) 02-02-103 13:01:41 That won't matter to us. 02-02-103 13:02:15 A program is a little tougher to use if the prompts, help, and manual is in German. 02-02-103 13:03:03 If we get a license from the German division we can just install the english copy twice - once for our existing and once against the german license 02-02-103 13:03:41 I don't think anyone will be offended - as long as we have a license 02-02-103 13:04:00 At least IBM wouldn't sue us: there's no profit in it. 02-02-103 13:05:20 remember - if push comes to shove, we can use version 2 for the mirror 02-02-103 13:05:36 it will be painful, but certainly mot impossible 02-02-103 13:06:52 I double-checked the Fixpak page for DB2, and it seems the v.2 fixpaks are no longer available. :-( 02-02-103 13:07:09 Not even the 4. 02-02-103 13:07:11 That's ok. It still run just fine. 02-02-103 13:07:52 Actually, the v.4 fixpaks are available, but they won't upgrade to higher versions. 02-02-103 13:08:13 Same with the v.2 fixpaks. 02-02-103 13:11:12 DB2 is a great database. Especially the earlier versions. But it is not the only game it town. 02-02-103 13:11:40 B: New Business 02-02-103 13:12:06 B1: Mirrors/Cohost 02-02-103 13:12:34 Ken, you emailed me about your latest change. Please tell the group. :-) 02-02-103 13:12:48 Doug: Is there a specific license type we are looking for for v5? 02-02-103 13:13:09 Well, Sector and I had a "difference of opinion" as to the value of a text url... 02-02-103 13:13:38 For version 5 it would be better to have a server license, but we could use a personal version in a pinch (I think) 02-02-103 13:13:51 so I set one up to test. The voice mirror is at os2voice.easydns.us, 02-02-103 13:14:05 Doug: Thanks, just wanted to make sure I asked for the right thing 02-02-103 13:14:15 the warpdoctor mirror at warpdoctor.easydns.us. 02-02-103 13:14:50 They are both setup to update each day (night). 02-02-103 13:17:08 It even picked up the newest newsletter. 02-02-103 13:17:14 Searching....found! 02-02-103 13:18:06 As an aside, the main page links for the nl articles go to last month's issue (on VOICE1). 02-02-103 13:18:16 I notice that some warpdoctor links to voice pick up the mirror site, and some pick up the original site. Why is this happening? 02-02-103 13:18:49 Links from one site to the other I've left to go to the original. 02-02-103 13:20:30 RS and I were looking at that, there are some links which are "absolute", these Imade a script to change 02-02-103 13:21:21 as the site is updated. Some I leave as is. This should only be links to voice from warpdoctor, or vice-versa. 02-02-103 13:23:03 I can't help to think sometimes that the new management of walkabout is capping our bandwidth 02-02-103 13:23:27 I've never been able to see how fast. I either can get to it from net at work (real fast), or dialup (ughh). 02-02-103 13:23:28 You can only tell the difference by looking at the URL box. 02-02-103 13:23:55 RS: Is there any way to verify this? 02-02-103 13:24:32 not really walter... and I think it would be rude to ask point blank.. since we don't pay them anything 02-02-103 13:26:11 How does it look for you getting a T1? 02-02-103 13:26:28 Ken - the site looks great. You, and RS and Sector deserve a big thank you 02-02-103 13:27:10 We're currently looking at options. The provider we were going with had said 2nd qtr.... 02-02-103 13:27:17 Has sector tried web explorer on the mirror site yet? 02-02-103 13:27:27 now they say 4th. 02-02-103 13:27:50 WebEx won't work, it's the html, not the server. 02-02-103 13:28:08 actually 02-02-103 13:28:20 it is the server in the case of os2voice.org 02-02-103 13:28:48 webex is no good for warpdoctor.org because of my use of javascript 02-02-103 13:29:19 Anyway, we're talking to some other providers who actually say they're in our area. 02-02-103 13:29:43 Ken, I have no official status with VOICE, so this is just me personally speaking, but I would in favour of VOICE contributing at least a modest amount toward your network/internet costs. 02-02-103 13:30:10 So the upshot is it may be sooner than expected before. 02-02-103 13:30:34 Walter: not necessary, but appreciate the thought. 02-02-103 13:33:25 Well, DNS issues and such for the mirror. Mainly what the deal is with the current DNS host. 02-02-103 13:34:15 OK, we'll pick it next week under "Business arising from minutes" 02-02-103 13:34:27 ie, can RS get to DNS server and such. 02-02-103 13:35:13 We've already covered B2: Dyndns.org 02-02-103 13:35:37 Because if he can, or the primary DNS is moved to a host, the mirror could be mapped to voice in mere minutes. 02-02-103 13:36:17 I think DNS enteries might be too much to ask of walkabout :( 02-02-103 13:36:28 I agree. 02-02-103 13:36:30 Do they do them now? 02-02-103 13:39:02 Checked, yes walkabout has the nservers. 02-02-103 13:39:03 You could set up two domains on one dns, using dyndns.org. 02-02-103 13:39:20 I don't know much how speed you would lose, if any. 02-02-103 13:39:42 the custom service.. which requires a one time $30 donation 02-02-103 13:39:43 I've been reading the dyndns.org docs intensively lately. 02-02-103 13:42:03 the biggest problem with such a service is the state of most name servers on the internet 02-02-103 13:42:07 Any of the hosting services could be used. The thing to look at is ease of changing the addresses. 02-02-103 13:42:23 a lot of nameservers cache for x number of days 02-02-103 13:43:01 While testing warpdoctor.easydns.us, I changed the name and address. By the time I did 02-02-103 13:43:27 a lookup in the command prompt, the new address was active (seconds later). 02-02-103 13:43:37 You can get either static or dynamic, and each has a different length of caching time. I forget what the actual times are. 02-02-103 13:44:01 preferably we'd use this service on a static IP... the advantage being; if VOICE1 was to have to be relocated, we could get it back quickly 02-02-103 13:44:22 Static doesn't cost anything extra. 02-02-103 13:44:45 or if VOICE1 is going to be down for a extended period of time, we could transfer the DNS pointers over to the mirror fairly quickly 02-02-103 13:45:19 Right, and the mirror would automatically answer for voice1. 02-02-103 13:46:10 No need for emails to the users or anything. 02-02-103 13:46:47 That sounds ideal 02-02-103 13:46:59 ahh still gotta keep those cacheing name servers in mind.. but this would be much quicker than going through the normal channels 02-02-103 13:47:03 rs: you should probably look at the docs for the advanced custom service. They claim there is enough flexibility in there for enough the most experienced DNS user. 02-02-103 13:47:24 But for now the problem is walkabout has the ns, and like before, it may be better to let "sleeping dogs lie". 02-02-103 13:47:29 WalterOS2: it seems to be doing very well for XRange 02-02-103 13:48:32 I use DOmainDirect for wmetcalf.com, and I can go in anytime and change the DNS pointers myself. Can't you do this with Walkabout? 02-02-103 13:48:45 personally... I'm running my own name server... so I don't have to rely on my ISP's DNS :) 02-02-103 13:48:48 Need UserID and Password, of course. 02-02-103 13:49:28 I'm talking about the os2voice.org :-) 02-02-103 13:49:49 I can restart my name server to dump the cache myself 02-02-103 13:50:10 don't have to sit around and wait three days for them to refresh 02-02-103 13:50:32 RAT: What about os2voice.org on InternetWalkabout?? 02-02-103 13:50:48 On the easydns ns you can set time to live to under a minute. 02-02-103 13:53:05 there for... if we change the DNS pointers one day... the changes aren't visible till the name servers the users are using are refreshed 02-02-103 13:53:07 Not that that would stop some :) 02-02-103 13:53:19 RS: Can I ask you a question? 02-02-103 13:54:51 Next question: Who manages the os2voice.org DNS? 02-02-103 13:54:53 AKA Internet Solutions Inc. 02-02-103 13:55:12 walkabout.org holds it at this time 02-02-103 13:55:40 walkabout controls it... the registrar simply tells the root nameservers where to look 02-02-103 13:56:47 When VOICE1 is moved, how does the DNS "pointer" or delegation get changed? 02-02-103 13:58:07 You probably have to email them. :-( 02-02-103 13:58:26 yep 02-02-103 13:58:31 We talking about two different problems. 02-02-103 13:58:34 That depends on how you're primary record is setup. 02-02-103 13:59:19 if yu pay #30 itshould track it automatic soon as you hit dyndns page 02-02-103 13:59:56 Still, once the mirror/cohost is setup, sending them an email asking to have the DNS changed shouldn't be that big a deal. 02-02-103 14:00:49 XRange: the final word from the expert. :-) 02-02-103 14:01:34 hehe thats not exactly how it works XRange... not on all ISP's... RR perhaps because its a high speed provider 02-02-103 14:02:29 well really mine hasn't changed once in over year. Once cause i put in new router. 02-02-103 14:04:05 Anyway, it's time we wrapped up the meeting. 02-02-103 14:04:32 Someone want to move an adjournment? 02-02-103 14:04:45 so moved 02-02-103 14:04:45 motion to adjourn 02-02-103 14:05:02 All in favour, type Aye. 02-02-103 14:05:05 Aye 02-02-103 14:05:08 Aye 02-02-103 14:05:09 Aye 02-02-103 14:05:10 aye 02-02-103 14:05:11 Aye 02-02-103 14:05:11 Aye 02-02-103 14:05:13 aye 02-02-103 14:05:47 motion carried..meeting adjourned.